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08 July 2017 @ 08:39 am
Feature Or Else  
The title of this post is actually "The Tiger Can't Change Its Stripes" Revisited. After commenting on Shanglong's journal about Myers Briggs I wanted to bring up this old post I made a few years ago. The Tiger Can't Change Its Stripes. Myers Briggs is based on real psychology originally started by research done by Carl Jung. INTP btw. It is a true science and very accurate though all the tests currently out there are rather flawed. But the biggest flaw lies with the test taker. Most people that take these for the first time or are given one by a psychologist test wrong because they answer the questions as they think they should instead of answering honestly. They may not like something about themselves or admire a trait another type has and project it or answer as they wish they were. So they get wrong results. Shanglong brought up another flaw in that the person may not understand the question and answer wrong because of this as well as apathy. "This question is not important I'll put anything down." When I first took the text I was answering wrong and kept getting ISTJ as a result and occasionally INTP. I respect S types, grew up with them and said yes to some of the questions about liking rules, following orders or traditions, past experience, senses etc. And I would get S type as a result of this. But the more I read about the types the more I noticed it did not add up in real life. Also back then I did not understand what intuition was and that I used it way more than I realized. I actually don't respect rules and break them often or bend them so long as it's not out right breaking the law. I find exceptions to the rules then use those to get around problems much to others' annoyance. S types don't do that. If they think a rule is wrong they might voice that it is stupid but still heed it. I found myself doing these kinds of things way too often. So why was I answering these questions with a "Yes"? It was then I told myself to stop doing that and be honest on those questions and once I did I got my true result of INTJ. My N was the weakest and I think it still is which is why it is easy for me to think like an S type and relate to them. But by weak I mean my N is in the upper 70's to mid 80s which is still high and way past the limit.

Another factor people misunderstand about the test is that if you get 50% say I then you're borderline and you're also a E? No. There is no borderline. You're not both. You can't be both. You are one or the other. Think of it as a health bar for your points so it is just a percent of how strong it is. Some witty INTP came up with this formula to explain the annoying 1% result you sometimes get on these tests. So 1% I means you're really an extrovert 99% of the time? No.

(x + 100)/2.

X is the variable you get. So if you got 1 for introversion you'd have 1 + 100 = 101/2 = 50.5. So that means you're really 50.5% introverted and 49.5% extroverted or you're borderline. A 1% is actually a borderline case. This means that my numbers just got sent through the roof! But it does make so much more sense this way. I was plugging in numbers just for the fun of it. Which in itself if very N. An S would take their number from this formula and be done with it. Here I am wanting to see all possibilities. Of course 100 cancels itself out so my I and my T being at 100% are just that. The higher the number you get the more accurate to that number it is hence think of your percent as a health bar not a tug of war.

So the point of the old article is you can't change your type. You are born into it unless you get some kind of brain damage. It is neurologically charged. Of course you can act different for a limited amount of time but going against your type will drain you not charge you so you can not keep it up forever. Acting within your four letters charges you while acting outside of them drains you. An INTP on a job has to be an INTJ. You have to be there on time, you have to meet deadlines, you have to act and do your job. Yes he can do it. He has to but he's dead at the end of the day. Therefore in a traumatic situation you don't change. Your true colors come forth as you can not keep up the charade. You guys know last year I went through Hell and a bit into the start of this year. I have not changed. Not to say you won't have moments of weakness. Everyone does. This is normal but you don't change. I love Popeye's quote with his accent, "I ams what I ams." So the issue here lies with flawed tests, poorly worded questions but most of all flawed test takers.

I want to share the Two sites that are my faves for descriptions of the 16 types. I tell people if they get confused by the tests to forget the tests and read all 16 types and decide for themselves. Those that are still unsure are usually P's. But I don't see how after a good amount of introspection one can not know themselves to figure it out. Typical INTJ response, "Their problem not mine."

Type logic
Personality Portraits

I will eventually add my own descriptions to the list as they are short and to the point. One thing to watch out for on these sites is typing of historical and fictional characters. They get this so majorly wrong. And what's worse is the other sites just copy and paste without questioning these things. From studying Myers Briggs so much over the years I am very good at typing both fictional and real people once I have had a decent amount of time to observe them. In fact typing characters in shows and movies is one of my fave past times. But how these people get some things so wrong is beyond me. For example 7 of 9 from Star Trek Voyager is listed as an INTJ. I do not know why when she's completely an ESTJ. For one she's a Borg and borgs once converted are extroverts. In one episode she even said she does what her "collective" decides as well as mentioning that she does not like to be alone at the start. I could go into a full detail of why she's ESTJ but that is not the point of this post. Some other time. Same with Star Trek's DS9's Dr Julian Basir who is listed as an introvert. What moron wrote that? He's ENFJ. Very loud, talks all the time, loves everyone, thinks everyone should love him. Raging extrovert for sure. I see so many of these characters typed wrong. In fact I really should write the type logic guy about Ishmael from Moby Dick is ISTP not INFP. I've read the book three times and am a big fan. He chose the one passage from the book where Ishmael was out of character because yes he was worried that his friend was dying. Thinking types do have feelings but it takes a lot for us to show them. One of my fave parts of Moby Dick was when Ishmael found a rug in his motel and didn't know what it was for so he looked at it, touched, it smelled, put his ear on it and even bit it and licked it. And at the end he still didn't know what it was for and put it away. That was so funny to me. Yeah S type. I'd love to see that in a future movie adaption of him with a rug in his mouth. So be careful of that and be careful of the match making. Remember similar types get along best. Read my other post about my One Letter Difference Rule.


Finally about the subject of this post. It's just my N messing with the LJ system. I found in the setting were to remove myself from being featured on the front page. I'm curious if this post will make it on and still wonder why my stuff is only just now getting featured when I've been here for 12 years and had that setting unknowingly turned out. AudeS is right. My journal is way more interesting than anything on the front page as it's mostly boring garbage from shallow people. Once I've had my fun I'm turning on that feature because I don't give a dang. Happy to be popular and now I put an end to it.

EDIT: They took the bait. I don't know if the feature thing is done by a robot or some moderator actually reads public posts and posts them on the front page. As of now it says I'm on there. I don't care about where. But now I have turned off that setting so I should soon be pulled off the front page too. HAHA yes it is gone now. Successful experiment. And an example of what INTJ's do to test the limits of things.
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actipton80actipton80 on July 8th, 2017 01:24 pm (UTC)
I personally think the people who get 50% on something can flip the easiest and hold it for the longest. I call it being squishy.

I can totally understand about letters being fed. Sometimes my S demands to be fed at my I's expense. A time like that would be the Christmas Show. There are lots of fun things to do, see, try, and buy, but there are also crowds so when I get on the bus to go home, I'm happy because my S is full, but I collapse exhausted on the seat because my I is drained.
Desthagirion on July 8th, 2017 02:00 pm (UTC)
Ha squishy. I like that.

Oh yes. Our letters love to be fed and sometimes are in conflict with each other. For me it's my I and my J. J wants to go out, do things, make things. My I can't always keep up.
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Des: INTP Lovethagirion on July 8th, 2017 03:22 pm (UTC)
I do to. Not only does it help you know your self but you can better interact with others to the point you will predict what they will do. Glad you liked my other article. It's still very helpful today. That book I scanned is great. The Introvert Advantage. Too bad it only focuses on E vs I. She mentions Myers Briggs but doesn't go into it.

I have a feeling your mother is ENTJ which is cool. I just don't get an S vibe out her. From what you've told me she doesn't seem like a detail oriented, by the book, strict personality to me. ESTJ's are the drill sargents and that is a good description.

Yes that is how the formula works. Works best on smaller numbers because the higher you go the more it catches up to the result you got.

Oh yes those lists on type logic are wrong. That's where he lists Ishmael as INFP and I want to strangle him for it. Clearly he hasn't read the book. I do like how he wrote the relationships like Confidant and Contrast. And that listing is different for everyone. INTP is my compliment. I forget what the rest are. And that grid is what inspired my One Letter Difference rule.

Yes I'm glad it's gone. It no longer says what place this post is on and I went to check the front page and it's not there so good riddance.
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Des: INTJ Death Starethagirion on July 8th, 2017 05:19 pm (UTC)
Those people are stupid and don't know anything. They're comparing fantasy with science. It can not be done. Also these are stupid people that are afraid to be classified. Yes you fit somewhere and as a biologist that loves taxonomy I like classifying all kinds of things and people.

Thanks. Well I can't say for certain but just going on what you've said she seems like ENTJ to me. Ah I forgot to cover this on our other conversation. I hate it when people confuse confidence and arrogance and pride. Pride is good to have. It is healthy. There's a famous quote that says "It's not bragging if you can do it." And so long as you don't put someone else down I see no problem with "bragging". There's nothing wrong with self praise either. Being humble is pressed too much in society to the point they don't want you to be proud when you have every right. If someone gets offended it's their fault because they probably have some issues with failure and jealousy. So yes another thing I am not sorry about and can relate to ENTJ's with.

And yes about E vs I. Extroversion does not mean confident. This is one reason I created Gord. There are shy extroverts. And being an extrovert doesn't mean you're born knowing all the social graces. There are many shy extroverts that aren't good at socializing but they try anyway. ENFP is what comes to mind as they seem to me to be the most shy and awkward of extroverts. Gord is shy and not very good at socializing. He never was and never will be.

Well years ago I took a test. I got INTJ on the first try but didn't think anything of it. Back then I used to post quiz and test results on LJ all the time. Not long after that Chris found the same test one morning and took it and got INTP. He came into the room all happy and jumping on the bed and going "I'm an INTP!!" I nearly punched him as I was still sleeping. "So what? I'm a J." I said and went back to sleep. Haha. After that I decided to join him and read more about it. So in a way he got me into it on the same day he got into it.
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Des: INTJ Death Starethagirion on July 8th, 2017 08:57 pm (UTC)
I do too and it fits here. Glad you liked my older article. Yes you can't change your type. I love looking back on my childhood and seeing how I have always acted like my type in so many situations just proving that I am what I am. Before I knew what Myers Briggs was I was acting my personality.

Yeah I misunderstood some of the questions too and got wrong answers because of it.

That guy knows nothing about types. Megamind is a perfect INTJ. Titan was the ENFP villain. What a moron. I hate it when people spread misinformation like this and look no one questions it. The only ENFP I like is Ray from The Real Ghostbusters. And I think he would bug me if he were a real person. How can anyone confuse the easiest things to tell apart which is E vs I? Megamind is an introvert. Hates crowds and people. The end was great when he nearly blasted everyone for moving in too fast on him. Being alone doesn't bother him. He prefers it.

It did get featured. It was like 26th then I pulled the plug and now they can't post me there.
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Desthagirion on July 8th, 2017 11:11 pm (UTC)
Same here. I always loved the villains and wanted them to win. Those are cool villains though I don't remember much about Ratigan or if I liked him. When I used to play with other kids I'd usually only play with just one and I would lead the game to the point I'd even tell the other kid what to say with his toy. That's typical INTJ taking charge.

Gosh yes that guy totally screwed that up with Megamind. Ras Al Ghul is not a feeling type. I don't know enough about the others to say but from what I've seen I think he's wrong about them all. Everything there is now questionable.

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Desthagirion on July 9th, 2017 11:22 am (UTC)
I know I watched that movie a long time ago and didn't like it. I'm not sure why and have forgotten most of it probably for the better.

I did too. I didn't have a lot of friends but like now I valued the ones I had. I used to build cities and forts too. I used to put all the chairs in rows and cover them with towels opening to a big batcave like place at the end. To me that was so cool to go through the tunnels.
jokerforever: Velmont Thinkingjokerforever on July 9th, 2017 05:38 am (UTC)
Very interesting read. Yeah I did notice that a lot of these tests are flawed to some degree, which is a shame since it's meant to a simple honest answer as opposed to right or wrong answers, and it certainly doesn't help that newcomers want to be a certain type when really they can't. I admit I was not to sure how to answer the test when you originally sent it to me, mostly because I wasn't all too familiar with MBTI at the time so the first time didn't test very well. Fortunately I gained a better understanding over time so and my INTP results are now more apparent, though really it was that link you sent me on my first post of Mr. Snide that helped me most. I actually chuckled a little bit when you said, "an INTP on the job has to be an INTJ", because that applies to me in every sense, I have to meet deadlines and take my job seriously in order to keep said job and then I'm almost drained by the end of the day. Sometimes I even have to be an Extrovert on the job which is even more draining when I have to talk to various people.

These are rather interesting sites you shared, yet it is such a shame that they don't list the correct personality types for each individual and instead just copy and paste it, such an inconvenience.

I like the title of your older post, "The Tiger Can't Change It's Stripes", when I think of that title and the subject I think of this post, https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/3d/6e/6a/3d6e6a2a4cbbb9859959cc7ed11b443b.jpg

I digress though, these are valid points you have shared about how you can't change personality types even if you want to. Quite frankly why should one want to? As Popye put it, "I ams what I ams", and should be proud of it.

Edited at 2017-07-09 05:38 am (UTC)
Desthagirion on July 9th, 2017 11:29 am (UTC)
I think we all made these mistakes the first time we took these tests. There used to be one that was very good that had 72 questions so that made it more accurate just for having so many. But then they changed it and I totally quite using and sharing it. It does help to know the types going into the test but then you run the risk of answering to get your fave type instead of what you really are. Since I have no problem accepting myself I found great pleasure in how I fit into INTJ more and more everytime I read about it. That's the wonderful thing about this once you know. You keep saying, "Yes, yes oh yes that's so me."

Oh yeah that's so true. Chris has to deal with it too at work and also be an E. He has to do customer service and talk to people everyday. It sucks and yes he's so tired when he comes home. One reason I quite my job at the museum was I couldn't take it anymore talking to stupid people. They were nice but I just had it with some of the dumb questions and pretending to be nice. It was really messing me up physically after all those years.

Oh wow finally someone made a nice chart out of the types. Other than INFP which I question about being a seal, this is very good. I would have put butterfly for INFP. Perhaps I will rework it and post this myself. I think the font is too small so yes I will definitely fix this and improve upon it. Ha so INTJ. Find flaws and improve.

Yes people need to accept what they are, be proud and work with the gifts they have.
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Desthagirion on July 9th, 2017 12:17 pm (UTC)
Ha that's great you won. Jerks like that need to be put in their place. Interesting that your J is your weakest. Well you can understand INTP better for it the way I can sort of understand ISTJ.

Oh yes it definitely will mess you up to pretend for too long.

Yes unfortunately the T types do have feelings. Everyone has emotions unless they have a disorder like psychopathy. I love the ep of Star Trek Voyager where they showed Tuvok the vulcan as a kid. He had a lot of anger and when he went to see the old wise teacher he told him that he was afraid. The teacher said, "Yes. I am. Surprised I said that?" He was shocked. Not the answer he expected since he thought Vulcans have no emotions. They do they just are very good at suppressing them. The old guy explained that denying you have feelings is a big mistake but you work to suppress them so they do not rule you. I love that ep. So Tuvok went through training and now is very controlled and cold. If only we all could be Vulcans.

Yes seems like they are not picky about what gets featured.